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April 24, 2019, 11:54:56 am
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What size blade flanges - Coolant depth ??

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Author Topic: What size blade flanges - Coolant depth ??  (Read 1857 times)
Bruce
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« on: February 08, 2009, 10:27:26 am »

A few more questions on slab saw design,

For an 18" blade of average thickness, what size flanges (washers, supports, on both sides of the blade)
would you use?

How far below the base of the opening in the vise should the center of the blade be? , just enough so that any rock will clear the flanges as it passed through?

How far up from the bottom of the blade should the coolant be?

How much space is needed in between the bottom of the blade and the tank bottom to allow for an adequate
amount of coolant?

Thanks,  Bruce
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travelerga
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« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2009, 11:24:19 am »

Bruce, on my 18" saw my washers are 2" in diameter. 1/4 to 1/2 inch is my oil depth. If I use much more it foams like crazy.  If you blade comes through a plate,lie my 8" saw it only comes through 2 7/8 inches. My 18" is shaft mounted and the vice carriage is just above the washers, I could conceivably cut an 7" stone but keep my stone size to 6" tall.
hope it helps.
Mike
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Bluesssman
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« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2009, 11:41:35 am »

I think the type of oil make a difference in foaming. I use Shell Diala Oil AX. Very little smell and no foaming even with the blade submerged over and inch.
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Bruce
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« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2009, 11:01:34 am »

After a little more digging on the net I found out that a flange diameter should be 25% of the width of the blade , so a 18 " blade should technically have a 4.5 flange.  I also spoke to some one at MK diamond
that confirmed this,  Covington uses the same arbor for their 18-24" saws, and they told me its flange was about 3",  They also sell alluminiun milled flanges on their site under the pulley section,  I am wondering if they are strong enough, I think steel would be better but so far I cant find any.

I think I am going to use a 20" blade and would like to find some nice steel flanges about 4-4.5"

If any one knows where I could get some let me know

Thanks Bruce
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Taogem
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« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2009, 01:01:19 pm »

At what point of saw blade diameter does it start to require larger motors (hp or amps)?

When we purchase or build saws I would imagine some thought is given to what diameters of material were going to be slabbing.

What are the advantages to having a 20" blade over a 14" blade if the same 1/4 hp motor is used for either one?

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Bluesssman
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« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2009, 01:30:46 pm »

I think the main advantage of the 20" blade would be it's ability to cut larger rock. Pulley sizes would be different because you want the speed of the cutting edge regulated and a 20 inch blade with nothing else changed would have a faster speed than a 14" blade. As far as horsepower is concerned, a friend who is a tile setter, swears by more horsepower provides better cutting and a longer lasting motor. The motor on my 24 inch saw is a one horsepower.
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Taogem
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« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2009, 01:53:59 pm »

I have a 3/4 hp motor that I thought about putting on my slab saw, but it runs at 3450 rpm. That is really screaming I think, and can't slow it down.

How fast is your 1 hp? and about how many rpm do you suppose your blade might be running at?

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Bruce
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« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2009, 03:19:21 pm »


Here are some specs from Barranca,  their saws are designed to run different sized blades per saw.




SPECIFICATIONS
                                HP18                      HP24
Motor                        Baldor                     Baldor
Horsepower                1.5 Hp                     1.5 Hp
Voltage                      120V / 60 Hz             120V / 60 Hz
Amperage                     8                              8
Motor RPM                  1725                         1725
Blade RPM                  700                            500
Arbor Size 1” 1”
Blade capacity             16” / 18” / 20”            20” / 24”
Depth of Cut                5.75” / 6.75” / 7.5”        7.5” / 9”
Blade Flange                 4 1/2”                            5”
Vise Opening                8”                                  17”
Drain Cap 2” 2”
Box L x W x H               36” x 24” x 46”               54” x 37” x 50”
Dry Weight                    580                                   720
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Taogem
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« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2009, 03:28:59 pm »

Maybe it is just this particular motor that I have...

Are there 1.5 hp motors that run stock without the need to reduce via pulleys at 1725?

It seems like it would take a huge pulley at the blade end to reduce my 3425 motor rpm motor down to 500 - 800 blade rpm.

Not sure it can be done.

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Bruce
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« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2009, 03:57:03 pm »

Yes there are.
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travelerga
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« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2009, 05:55:05 pm »

George, a 2" motor pully and an 8.5 " driven pully will give you 800 rpm

http://gadi.agric.za/software/renting/pulley.php

mike
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« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2009, 07:23:06 pm »

Thanks for that Mike.....

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Bluesssman
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« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2009, 09:30:48 pm »

My motor is 3450 rpm but with the pulleys the blade rpm is 575.  I can't post picture... something is full.
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Taogem
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« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2009, 10:44:15 pm »

 I can't post picture... something is full.

I will add more MB space right now..

Thanks for mentioning it !
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Bluesssman
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« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2009, 08:09:46 am »

This is the simple setup of pulleys on my slab saw.

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Taogem
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« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2009, 02:34:01 pm »

Mine is not so easy..... Would not work for a bunch of reasons.. 

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Bluesssman
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« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2009, 03:17:37 pm »

I can see what you mean! So your unit has one motor to run both the saw blade and the feed.
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« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2009, 04:09:45 pm »

So your unit has one motor to run both the saw blade and the feed.

Yes...
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theimage1
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« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2009, 10:42:12 am »

I can truthfully say I have never seen a more complex mechanism to cut a rock!
It must have been a home made rig, or the manufacturer would have gone out of business trying to just keep the pulleys in stock.

The most amazing thing to me, is that nothing in the picture appears to be connected to the shaft of the saw blade. Does the blade just turn in sympathy because everything else is turning?

Wow.
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Taogem
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« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2009, 11:11:57 am »

Does the blade just turn in sympathy because everything else is turning?

Wow.

 ;D  ;D  ;D

Follow the belt up from the motor to the pulley towards the top. The blade is running off that..

While that belt is turning, "out of sympathy" it rubs up against the adjacent large pulley and that is where that complex series of pulleys come into play that eventually work the feed.

It is homemade for sure....... The guy I bought it from made it, but the guy who's house I picked it up from had an identical unit !

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Bluesssman
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« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2009, 11:19:50 am »

I wonder if you get much belt slippage where the main drive belt's back contacts the back of the belt on the big pulley? You have mentioned some problems cutting larger stones.
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« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2009, 11:53:07 am »

I wonder if you get much belt slippage

I know what you mean, but believe it or not, no slippage at all....

The motors breaker switch will trip off if I don't have the feed set way down so that the blade can keep up with the cutting. In other words, the motor use to get hot because of the rock being pushed up against a blade that just will not cut. Rick use to get fairly hot too. The belts never did slip though..

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Bluesssman
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« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2009, 01:00:37 pm »

What size motor does your saw use?
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2009, 01:10:19 pm »

What size motor does your saw use?

The tag is situated where I can't see the writing on it. That part of the motor is hidden by a piece of iron.

The previous ones I had on there were 1/4 hp. I vaguely remember bringing home a 1/2 hp that I am pretty sure went on the saw.

Pretty sure I put that 1/2 hp on there.
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Bluesssman
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2009, 01:16:58 pm »

I am just rambling, but looking at your saw with all of its belts and pulleys and the 90 degree gearing, I am wondering if too much horse power is being lost. Especially if the motor is getting hot! There may be too much demand for a 1/2 horse motor.

Gary
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« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2009, 01:48:53 pm »

It's no longer getting hot as I changed a couple of pulleys to slow down the feed so as to not strain the blade and motor.

It is probably difficult to concept by looking at the pic, but there is no strain or friction at all on any of the belts.

I keep coming back to the blade itself. Even though it appears to be very new, it just sucks.

Now I have yet to run the green abrasive wheel through it a bit as was suggested. Been cutting rock the last couple of days. Slow going but at least it is working.

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Seth
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« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2009, 02:15:21 pm »

I have never seen a saw set up like this. Maybe get rid of the pulleys in the middle and run from your main drive pulley to a step pulley in the front with a simple tension pulley with a spring to keep the belt tight in the middle. Then all you have to do is put the belt in the diiferent slots in the step pulley.
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Bluesssman
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« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2009, 02:26:38 pm »

I think you will find all of the pulleys are necessary to reduce the rpm at the 90 degree gear setup for proper feed speed. Just my .02...
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Seth
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« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2009, 02:39:12 pm »

Not sure if you are responding to my post Bluesman but all of those pulleys are not needed in my book.
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« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2009, 03:19:53 pm »

I think you will find all of the pulleys are necessary to reduce the rpm at the 90 degree gear setup for proper feed speed. Just my .02...

Yes, your right...

That plus it all is in conjunction with the speed of the screw drive as it leaves the old tractor steering box unit.

The combination of all the pulleys act as a reduction for the feed.

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Seth
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« Reply #30 on: February 13, 2009, 03:25:15 pm »

There is not one step pulley on that rig.
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Bluesssman
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« Reply #31 on: February 13, 2009, 03:43:53 pm »

Seth, I think what you are missing is the large pulley (the left one of the two) gets it's movement from the back of the saw blade belt. It is a very unusual setup!!
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Seth
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« Reply #32 on: February 13, 2009, 04:04:07 pm »

The rear drive that runs the blabe should be set up with a step pulley with at least 2 steps to run blade at proper speed and it should send power to the front for feed rate. From what I see there is no way to control the feed to the front feed gear without a step pulley. All feed rates are set now by a set of pulleys that are at a fixed feed rate. A good step pulley would change this problem. Just my opinion.
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« Reply #33 on: February 13, 2009, 07:17:21 pm »

I can't have a step pulley there. If I did, the result of moving the belt from one step to another would result in the belt not lining up with the larger pulley. The belt would not be able to hit the pulley squarely and would fall off to one side of the larger pulley or the other.

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