Lapidary / Gemstone Community Forum

Lapidary Shop => Slab Saws, Trim Saws, Blades & Lubricants For Both / General Operating => Topic started by: denny on December 28, 2013, 12:58:18 pm



Title: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 28, 2013, 12:58:18 pm
Ok, let me get the obvious out of the way first.  I'm anal.  There I said it.

When I drain my 16" slab saw I also clean out the inside fairly thoroughly.  I used to clean it until it shined, but Tony convinced me that wasn't necessary.  Now it just is...clean, mostly. 

I was thinking about putting some sort of lining, burlap, plastic bag, whatever, on the bottom of the saw in order to be able to easily remove the clay that builds up on the bottom over a period of time.  Tony feels that burlap might absorb too much oil but I suspect that it either wouldn't amount to all that much or I could just dump the burlap into the drained oil and let it drain with all the rest of the gunk.  My primary concern is that somehow or another it could get tangled around the blade, although I can't see that happening.

Any thoughts, concerns, kindred souls?????


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: PanaMark on December 28, 2013, 01:17:45 pm
I have been thinking along the same lines as you are, but I am looking to find some shallow plastic trays that fit quite tight and fully in the bottom. That way I can drain and most of the sludge will be in the trays (along with some oil). Then by carefully lifting out the trays I can remove most of the sludge and chips, etc.

I think you might need something with a raised edge/lip otherwise the sludge will pour off as you lift it.

Maybe others have found a good solution they can share.  ?????


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: sealdaddy on December 28, 2013, 01:22:31 pm
My primary concern is that somehow or another it could get tangled around the blade, although I can't see that happening.

Any thoughts, concerns, kindred souls?????

The blade really does not cause much turbulence, but if you weighed the bag down initial it wouldn't have a chance to catch it anyway...IMO

How much room is btwn the blade and bottom, btw?


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 28, 2013, 03:35:23 pm
Mark - I'm not talking about the traditional "pudding" but rather the hard clay that forms on the base of the saw.  Whatever I would use would come up all sides about 4" or so.  However, even it was "form-fitting" and lay flat on the bottom, it shouldn't be a problem to pry up an edge.  the biggest problem would be how to guide it around the obstacles created by one or two metal braces that are around the arbor and blade.  I'm afraid that part of the saw would probably not be easy to do.

Don - without looking at it, from my recliner lol15, I'd guess about 1/2-1".


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Rockoteer on December 28, 2013, 04:06:01 pm

I have thought about this but I have come to the conclusion (on the order of denny's) that trying to guide it around all the stuff in the way that it wouldn't be worth it, to me anyway.
I drain the oil then take a plastic putty knife and scrape the sludge (the thick clay crap) loose and then just pick it up and drop it in the can.
again.....jmho


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: sealdaddy on December 28, 2013, 04:27:13 pm
the biggest problem would be how to guide it around the obstacles created by one or two metal braces that are around the arbor and blade.  I'm afraid that part of the saw would probably not be easy to do.


You'd need to "bag it off" in sections, I guess.
You're not concerned about getting the crud up intact, just easier than scraping, right?



Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Allen on December 28, 2013, 07:27:47 pm
Maybe I am missing something but I fail to see the benefit in draining the oil at all.

I do a regular clean, saw use is less than a hour per day. The saw is a 14" Lortone.

So once a fortnight or so I use a plastic laundry powder dispenser (scoop) that has a flat bottom to scoop up the gunk and place it in brown paper lunch bags to drain. Initially overnight in the saw then hanging in plastic shopping bags over a bucket.

Some of the bags have hung there for 6 months or more and are still giving up oil.

After a clean a small oil top up is necessary but nothing big.

This cleaning process takes about 15 minutes and is not too mucky. 


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: legendarygranite on December 28, 2013, 11:14:55 pm
My input would be cheese cloth or the same mesh used in the paint industry. I haven't really fully set up shop, but will try to clean my saws on some kind of schedule that would prevent muck. I recycle my oil, why not empty the saws out before it loses it flow.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Michael S Hoover - Redrummd on December 29, 2013, 12:23:13 am
My saws run pretty darn clean for all of the use they get.  As soon as I get more  than about an inch of gunk at the bottom of the saw I start scraping it forward with a 1 x 4 piece of wood and put the mud into a bucket to start to settle.  I simply have several buckets of mud lined up that I pour the oil off as it rises.  Once it gets to be more like putty I start bagging it and adding it to the trash.  No need to ever empty a saw in my opinion.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 29, 2013, 08:21:26 am

I have thought about this but I have come to the conclusion (on the order of denny's) that trying to guide it around all the stuff in the way that it wouldn't be worth it, to me anyway.
I drain the oil then take a plastic putty knife and scrape the sludge (the thick clay crap) loose and then just pick it up and drop it in the can.
again.....jmho

Great minds think alike! lol15


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 29, 2013, 08:21:59 am
the biggest problem would be how to guide it around the obstacles created by one or two metal braces that are around the arbor and blade.  I'm afraid that part of the saw would probably not be easy to do.


You'd need to "bag it off" in sections, I guess.
You're not concerned about getting the crud up intact, just easier than scraping, right?



Yep.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 29, 2013, 08:25:30 am
Maybe I am missing something but I fail to see the benefit in draining the oil at all.

I do a regular clean, saw use is less than a hour per day. The saw is a 14" Lortone.

So once a fortnight or so I use a plastic laundry powder dispenser (scoop) that has a flat bottom to scoop up the gunk and place it in brown paper lunch bags to drain. Initially overnight in the saw then hanging in plastic shopping bags over a bucket.

Some of the bags have hung there for 6 months or more and are still giving up oil.

After a clean a small oil top up is necessary but nothing big.

This cleaning process takes about 15 minutes and is not too mucky. 

I run my 16" 4-6 hours daily so it takes about a month before the oil starts to become pudding.  By that time, the clay has already formed on the bottom.  I suppose I could clean mine out ever two weeks or so but I think I'd waste more oil that way than save.  besides, my intent is not to reclaim all the oil I can down to the very last drop, but rather to make cleanout easier.  When I clean out my saw, it is a several hour process to reach the point that I'm satisfied with the result.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: john likes rocks! on December 29, 2013, 09:18:57 am
A margin trowel make saw cleaning pretty easy, I'll even admit I enjoy scrapping the clay it is strangely satisfying.  hide35

 


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 29, 2013, 10:28:05 am
Well, I just finished the process.  I got the saw MOSTLY clean (a concession to Tony and others who say I don't need to :).  The pictures are below is reverse order as I don't know how to juggle the pix on PB to make them come up in the correct order.  I think you'll get the idea.

John - wouldn't a metal trowel scrape off the paint (or is that unimportant since it will always be under oil?)

(https://gemstone.smfforfree4.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1154.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp530%2Fabbygolden%2Fcleaningsaw004_zpsb01dbd70.jpg&hash=45fd652c90d73220e35b7fefda85095f) (http://s1154.photobucket.com/user/abbygolden/media/cleaningsaw004_zpsb01dbd70.jpg.html)
(https://gemstone.smfforfree4.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1154.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp530%2Fabbygolden%2Fcleaningsaw003_zps83d78528.jpg&hash=cfb14f3de517b7ebf5c1cb2a38e1e61f) (http://s1154.photobucket.com/user/abbygolden/media/cleaningsaw003_zps83d78528.jpg.html)
(https://gemstone.smfforfree4.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1154.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp530%2Fabbygolden%2Fcleaningsaw002_zps979ce6f2.jpg&hash=51781bc57633aa2a93d1b825d36617fd) (http://s1154.photobucket.com/user/abbygolden/media/cleaningsaw002_zps979ce6f2.jpg.html)
(https://gemstone.smfforfree4.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1154.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fp530%2Fabbygolden%2Fcleaningsaw001_zpsad8e9872.jpg&hash=bd74c667feb28b91f1a121ab3ee89d23) (http://s1154.photobucket.com/user/abbygolden/media/cleaningsaw001_zpsad8e9872.jpg.html)


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: deb193 on December 29, 2013, 11:53:09 am
IMO. Too much fuss. I just vacuum sludge out, pour in strainer bucket, and replace with what I strained last time. About every 3rd time I also use a 1.5gal spray tank to spray down parts with clean mineral oil.

There is no reason to get it as clean as you show here unless you need to handle/disassemble.

It takes less than 30 minutes to setup, evacuate, and refill.

Just saying.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: PhilNM on December 29, 2013, 01:00:55 pm
IMHO, you are overcleaning. Wayyyyy overcleaning. Scrape out the clay, top off the oil, and start cutting again. There is NO good reason for making a saw spotless clean. Clean oil  yes, clean saw, waste of time!

How about some quarry tiles laid in the bottom, you then pick up each tile, scrape it into a bucket, put it back and get back to cutting?


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Rockoteer on December 29, 2013, 02:14:11 pm

And there you have it folks.  PhilNM's idea is the best I have heard so far.  My 12/14" saw is at that place right now.  I'm going to use this method as soon as it warms up a tad.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 29, 2013, 03:11:30 pm
IMHO, you are overcleaning. Wayyyyy overcleaning. Scrape out the clay, top off the oil, and start cutting again. There is NO good reason for making a saw spotless clean. Clean oil  yes, clean saw, waste of time!

How about some quarry tiles laid in the bottom, you then pick up each tile, scrape it into a bucket, put it back and get back to cutting?

It's hard to teach an old dog new tricks.  Just like I still change the oil in my vehicles every 3,000 miles.  If the process ain't broke, don't fix it kind of thing.  As far as time is concerned, that's all I have.  Trust me when I tell you that this is by FAR the dirtiest the saw has been after draining since I first got it.  You can never over clean something.  It might not need that much but I'll stay with my system.  I just put on my shoulder length vet gloves, whip the spatula around, use a roll of paper towels and put in fresh oil.  Works for me.  Now if this plastic bag on the bottom will contain the clay, I'll be satisfied.

I like your idea of quarry tiles.  If the plastic bag doesn't work, I'll try that.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Rockoteer on December 29, 2013, 04:18:42 pm

And there you have it folks.  PhilNM's idea is the best I have heard so far.  My 12/14" saw is at that place right now.  I'm going to use this method as soon as it warms up a tad.

And there you have it folks.  Denny's idea is the best I have heard so far.  My 12/14" saw is at that place right now.  I'm going to use this method as soon as it warms up a tad.

I am so fickle it's funny.  Actually what I am saying is I do like to clean my saws up real good, right down to using my power washer on it......but.....I will try PhiNM's way also.   Not agin new ways ..... know what I mean Vern?


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: PhilNM on December 29, 2013, 05:16:12 pm
:)


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: sealdaddy on December 30, 2013, 08:14:43 am
IMO. Too much fuss. I just vacuum sludge out

Vacuum?...what power/size shop vac?
You have one dedicated for that purpose only?


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: denny on December 30, 2013, 08:25:55 am
There are several video tutorials dedicated to the making, and use of, dry vacs to clean out your slab saw.  One by Tony (Catmandewe) is excellent, but there are others as well.  As far as size, it depends on how much oil your saw will hold.  For my 16" saw, a  five gallon shop vac would be sufficient.   Try here:
http://andy321.proboards.com/thread/21533/slab-sucker


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: sealdaddy on December 30, 2013, 09:45:46 am
Excellent~!!
Thanks, neighbor~


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: legendarygranite on December 30, 2013, 11:52:44 am
I don't think I would used water to clean my saw, water and bearing don't mix.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: Cowboy on December 31, 2013, 08:06:45 pm
Wow. Call me Dirtbag.  In 19 years I've only cleaned out my slab saw four times: each time I needed to move it. I find the oil gets dirty, but if it sits for a couple weeks without use, all the sediment settles and stays down.  When I move the saw, I drain the oil and scrape a couple inches of nearly-solid mud out of the bottom. I simply don't see a reason to clean it out more often. The sediment causes no problems in the operation of the saw. It slowly fills up the "bathtub" but the thing is so deep anyway that it causes no trouble. It saves me having to top off the oil so often to keep the level above the blade.


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: DadOhs on May 21, 2014, 08:03:34 pm
Wow. Call me Dirtbag.  In 19 years I've only cleaned out my slab saw four times: each time I needed to move it. I find the oil gets dirty, but if it sits for a couple weeks without use, all the sediment settles and stays down.  When I move the saw, I drain the oil and scrape a couple inches of nearly-solid mud out of the bottom. I simply don't see a reason to clean it out more often. The sediment causes no problems in the operation of the saw. It slowly fills up the "bathtub" but the thing is so deep anyway that it causes no trouble. It saves me having to top off the oil so often to keep the level above the blade.

I know this is an older thread but I had to comment on this.... if you have a large/deep sump you can get away with this, especially if you are not going **** with your saw...5+ hours/day, everyday. Or if you have a saw like mine where there is only 3 1/2 gallons of oil in it to make it work. I let my saw go for a month, maybe 2 and I have no choice but to clean out the saw. I drain it, scrape out the heavy deposits and then refill it with oil that I had filtered the previous cleaning
and away I go!
And while the sediment will settle out of the oil over time, when you turn on the saw the top layer of sediment will raise up and get lifted up by the blade and deposited onto what you are cutting thereby increasing the chance of cutting marks on the material being cut, and, reducing the life of the blade, because it has to work harder to cut and cool with sediment present in the oil.

When I have my saw going steadily, I tend to have it running about 6-9/day at least 5 days a week and some material is dirtier than others so the oil gets nasty faster, but I always wait till I get to the pudding stage or worse before cleaning the saw and I clean my saw at least 6 times/year. (During the summer it is harder to cut in my shop as I have no A/C in there and the temp hits 100+ on a regular basis.

So, no I don't think you're a dirtbag for your cleaning, I think it's great that you can do this, wish I could too, but understand not all of us have that large sump area to work with, so we have to clean it out more often!


Title: Re: Lining Inside of Slab Saw
Post by: fwfranklen on July 31, 2014, 02:44:14 pm
Ok, let me get the obvious out of the way first.  I'm anal.  There I said it.

When I drain my 16" slab saw I also clean out the inside fairly thoroughly.  I used to clean it until it shined, but Tony convinced me that wasn't necessary.  Now it just is...clean, mostly. 

I was thinking about putting some sort of lining, burlap, plastic bag, whatever, on the bottom of the saw in order to be able to easily remove the clay that builds up on the bottom over a period of time.  Tony feels that burlap might absorb too much oil but I suspect that it either wouldn't amount to all that much or I could just dump the burlap into the drained oil and let it drain with all the rest of the gunk.  My primary concern is that somehow or another it could get tangled around the blade, although I can't see that happening.

Any thoughts, concerns, kindred souls?????


I have a friend that uses pieces of used bed sheets as a liner for his 36 in saw. His wife sewed around the edges and even sewed in little lift handles. He has two so he just lifts the one out (after draining most of the oil) and puts the other one in place and returns the paper bag filtered oil. I never asked how he cleaned the bed sheet once removed?

Mike