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My first job. I think i need help

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albertto
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« on: January 15, 2016, 08:15:59 am »

Hello friends.
I present my first job in carved gems.
I started with a hydrothermal ametrino.
I have seen many flaws in my work, as they are more polished areas polished bites insufficient, especially with'm not sure having obtained all the glare or reflections with this size. I really do not know very well how to get angles for all possible brightness.

The work process that I followed were as follows:

-desbastado with 120 grit diamond tool.
-prepolish with 240 grit sandpaper 400-grit-800-grit 1200 grit
-Polishing with diamond paste 40-28-10-7-5-1 microns.

I would appreciate your opinions on whether use an adequate system of work and any advice that you could give me.

A greeting.


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« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2016, 01:25:51 pm »

Wow that is way cool toocool2

First or last piece I love it. Is the gold color a reflection or part of the stone? I will have to look up hydrothermal ametrino dunno


Very nice.

Bless
Shawn
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vitzitziltecpatl
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« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2016, 08:17:55 pm »

You need help with what...!?!?! Finding a new home for that wonderful piece, maybe???

No matter what you did, you did it right. You mention angles for brightness, but I think that applies more to faceting than carving.

There's no advice I could offer you about carving. You're obviously an artist, so the only thing to do is follow your instincts. This piece is beautiful.
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« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2016, 06:08:00 am »

It's an ametrine - amethyst/citrine hybrid. They occur naturally only in Brazil but most are lab created. BEAUTIFUL piece either way  yes

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Jeff from Michigan
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« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2016, 10:11:23 am »

  Looks beautiful, nice job. I bet you have a few thousand cabochons under your belt as well????  Either way you are way talented.  Really glad you stated it was a lab grown stone. I buy a lot of Ametrine that is too perfect for nature but they all swear it is from Brazil.  Can I ask how much time it takes to create a beauty like that?
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« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2016, 02:25:59 pm »

Wow that is really nice, thanks for showing!
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albertto
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« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2016, 05:19:38 am »

Hello friends, thanks for your kind answers.
The truth still observe many imperfections in the stone.
I have worked with sandpaper grit 1200 before moving to the diamond paste. Should I use sandpaper grit before 2,000 diamond paste?
Any idea how I can polish the stone grooves in a "V" ?. I had to do with the engine and hand, and I note that they have been some pitting.

Wow that is way cool toocool2

First or last piece I love it. Is the gold color a reflection or part of the stone? I will have to look up hydrothermal ametrino dunno


Very nice.

Bless
Shawn

Back Hello, color is stone, yellow and purple. I think the colors are mixed by the refraction of light. Ametrino piece had to buy on ebay, because in my country do not find him.

You need help with what...!?!?! Finding a new home for that wonderful piece, maybe???

No matter what you did, you did it right. You mention angles for brightness, but I think that applies more to faceting than carving.

There's no advice I could offer you about carving. You're obviously an artist, so the only thing to do is follow your instincts. This piece is beautiful.

Vitzitziltecpat Hello, thank you very much for your comment.

It's an ametrine - amethyst/citrine hybrid. They occur naturally only in Brazil but most are lab created. BEAUTIFUL piece either way  yes



Hello stdenis_jd. Indeed it is a gem created. I thought to start working with created stones could be the best, price, now that I'm starting.

  Looks beautiful, nice job. I bet you have a few thousand cabochons under your belt as well????  Either way you are way talented.  Really glad you stated it was a lab grown stone. I buy a lot of Ametrine that is too perfect for nature but they all swear it is from Brazil.  Can I ask how much time it takes to create a beauty like that?

Hi 55 fossil. It's the first I've carved stone . I have to confess that I have not finished any cabochon, but I'm working.
The time spent is difficult to pinpoint. I've been carving in my spare time. I have had several breaks and I cut twice because it was not satisfied with the result. I believe that I could use about 15 or 16 hours.
How lucky that you can have so much material to carve available in your country! It's amazing what I've seen on the Tuccson Show.

Wow that is really nice, thanks for showing!

John, thanks for your answer.
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Hummingbirdstones
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« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2016, 07:15:07 am »

Hi Albertto,

Your first carved stone is beautiful.  It's not easy to see the imperfections in the pictures.  If Debbie gets on  this thread, she may be able to give you some really good advice, since she carves -- Asianfire, too.

I do know that most carvers often have to make their own tools to polish insides v-cuts or any other depressions in the stone.  Wood dowels work well and you need to make a separate tool for each grit of diamond paste that you are going to use.  If you can, you might also want to buy a copy of Henry Hunt's book  "American Lapidary Designing the Carved Gemstone".  This is an awesome book and there is a section in there on tool making.  You can order it here if you're interesed:  http://www.gemworld.com/HenryHunt.asp

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« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2016, 03:00:25 pm »

 yes Really nice, like the folds...reminds me of dripping liquid plastic dancer5

Ken S.
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Debbie K
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« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2016, 07:30:01 pm »

Albertto:

I carve, too. Here is some of my work https://picasaweb.google.com/deborahkirkpatrick56.

I have found that the best way to get rid of the pits and imperfections in the "V" areas is to use stones before moving on with diamond paste or powder.

In the past, I tried a lot of things, but after many years have settled on what works best for me.

I start carving with the diamond burs. I move on to working by hand with diamond files and then moldmaker stones. As they usually only go up to 1200 grit, I then go to diamond powder and oil on wood, either with a flex shaft or by hand. With convex angles like what you have on your piece, I use popsicle sticks with diamond and oil up to 3000 or 8000. Depends on my mood, more than anything else. As most of my carvings are faces, I often go up to 3000 and then back to 1200 to get a more matte finish.

The moldmaker stones are sold by Gesswein. I don't remember what country you're in, but you can sometimes find comparable stones that are used for knife sharpening or honing. These are what I buy: http://www.gesswein.com/p-411-moldmaker-stones.aspx and then these http://www.gesswein.com/p-1120-super-fine-polishing-stones.aspx. Several places carry the diamond files; I buy the cheapest ones I can find at Harbor Freight; it doesn't seem that they carry them on their website anymore, but Gesswein carries them, too http://www.gesswein.com/c-371-files-and-rifflers.aspx and so does Jade Carver http://www.jadecarver.com/DiamondTools.htm, scroll down the page.

If you can't find these things where you are, diamond paste and flat sticks will work, just a little slower.

That all said, your carving is really, really good. I know what you're talking about with the pits and divots and that they may not be showing up on a photograph, but you can see them when you hold it in hand.

You may want to think about carving the back of the stone, too. It would give you another opportunity to reflect and refract light. There is a carver here in Texas that does that; I'm going to find some of his work and post it here to give you more ideas.

Really good work, really nice carving.

Debbie K
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albertto
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« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2016, 08:50:54 am »

Friends again thank you very much for your interest and for your time.

Hi Albertto,

Your first carved stone is beautiful.  It's not easy to see the imperfections in the pictures.  If Debbie gets on  this thread, she may be able to give you some really good advice, since she carves -- Asianfire, too.

I do know that most carvers often have to make their own tools to polish insides v-cuts or any other depressions in the stone.  Wood dowels work well and you need to make a separate tool for each grit of diamond paste that you are going to use.  If you can, you might also want to buy a copy of Henry Hunt's book  "American Lapidary Designing the Carved Gemstone".  This is an awesome book and there is a section in there on tool making.  You can order it here if you're interesed:  http://www.gemworld.com/HenryHunt.asp



Hello Hummingbird Stones. The photos are not of great quality, but I'm investigating how higher quality gems photograph.
Indeed, I have seen that some tools the need to manufacture. I already have some wooden discs to which I have carved the edges.
From what I've seen Henry Hunt's book is like the Bible of carvers gems. Thank you for your link. Of all the material I need, the book is one of them.

yes Really nice, like the folds...reminds me of dripping liquid plastic dancer5

Ken S.

Hello Ken, thanks for your answer. That was the idea. I very attractive soft curves and carvings.

Albertto:

I carve, too. Here is some of my work https://picasaweb.google.com/deborahkirkpatrick56.

I have found that the best way to get rid of the pits and imperfections in the "V" areas is to use stones before moving on with diamond paste or powder.

In the past, I tried a lot of things, but after many years have settled on what works best for me.

I start carving with the diamond burs. I move on to working by hand with diamond files and then moldmaker stones. As they usually only go up to 1200 grit, I then go to diamond powder and oil on wood, either with a flex shaft or by hand. With convex angles like what you have on your piece, I use popsicle sticks with diamond and oil up to 3000 or 8000. Depends on my mood, more than anything else. As most of my carvings are faces, I often go up to 3000 and then back to 1200 to get a more matte finish.

The moldmaker stones are sold by Gesswein. I don't remember what country you're in, but you can sometimes find comparable stones that are used for knife sharpening or honing. These are what I buy: http://www.gesswein.com/p-411-moldmaker-stones.aspx and then these http://www.gesswein.com/p-1120-super-fine-polishing-stones.aspx. Several places carry the diamond files; I buy the cheapest ones I can find at Harbor Freight; it doesn't seem that they carry them on their website anymore, but Gesswein carries them, too http://www.gesswein.com/c-371-files-and-rifflers.aspx and so does Jade Carver http://www.jadecarver.com/DiamondTools.htm, scroll down the page.

If you can't find these things where you are, diamond paste and flat sticks will work, just a little slower.

That all said, your carving is really, really good. I know what you're talking about with the pits and divots and that they may not be showing up on a photograph, but you can see them when you hold it in hand.

You may want to think about carving the back of the stone, too. It would give you another opportunity to reflect and refract light. There is a carver here in Texas that does that; I'm going to find some of his work and post it here to give you more ideas.

Really good work, really nice carving.

Debbie K

Hi Debbie K. Thanks for your response and your time to respond. I thank you.
Seeing your work, I think I'm far from reaching your quality and your technique, but I'm still working. I was impressed with the carved face and angle.
I did not know existed polishing stones. The truth that I really facilitate the work. Already I am looking at companies in my country, Spain, and one I found. I think my stone has lacked the polished stone before using diamond paste. This seems grinding stone that can be cut to fit a particular way.
Make a cut on the back of the stone, sorry I missed left photo. Now I think I put it right. I think I was wrong in the angle of the groove, and perhaps should have ended in groove edge, not flat. Also look for a suitable angle for the coefficient of refraction of quartz. Ufffff, how to do and learn.
Again thank you very much for giving your time.


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socalagatehound
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« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2016, 10:17:39 am »

SWEET!!! yes yes yes

Can't see anything wrong with it in the pictures. We are always our own harshest critics...
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Debbie K
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« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2016, 09:48:49 am »

Alberto:

Here are some links you may find interesting. The first in Larry Woods site, he facets the back of his stones. http://jewelsbywoods.com/descriptions.html. The second is the AGTA Spectrum award site. Go through and look at the winners for carving, innovative faceting and all other faceting. http://www.agta.org/awards/2015-winners.html I think it might give you some new ideas. I think you might find Dalan Hargrave's work particularly interesting http://www.gemstarz.com/Photoalbum/photoalbum.htm.

I understand your pursuit for perfection, although I may not share it. You have a faceter mentality. So if you want the polish to be perfect you will have to be careful to never advance to the next level until all scratches have been removed.

The moldmaker stones end up conforming to the shape of the piece, so you really don't have to cut them too much.

I think you have the capacity to be a outstanding carver, seeing this first piece. Indeed, I think you already are. You are going to be the only one who sees any problem with your piece; at least until you start entering competitions. They will be brutal. In competition pieces the finish has to be perfect. So now is as good a time as any to start doing it absolutely right.

Looking forward to seeing more of your work. Re: The Hunt book; it might be helpful, but a lot of the information is outdated. There are many carvers on this forum and I'd venture to say that the total knowledge here is more than you could get from that book. Ask questions; we will answer. Also, read this discussion: http://gemstone.smfforfree4.com/index.php/topic,10926.0.html. It will give you a wealth of information.

Debbie K

P.S. The main angle for faceted colored quartz is about 42 degrees
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albertto
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« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2016, 11:02:22 am »


Debbie , as always thank you very much for your answer. It has helped me a lot and you gave me several ideas that I'm practicing . I hope soon show you some of my work .

A greeting.
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« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2016, 09:14:33 pm »

It's an ametrine - amethyst/citrine hybrid. They occur naturally only in Brazil but most are lab created. BEAUTIFUL piece either way  yes



evidently you don't know that the best ametrine in the world comes from the USA...Hallelujah Junction, CA
not Brazil. Brazilian Ametrine has flooded the market with very low grade product.
Now Hallelujah is what the Gem Connoisseur buys and pays top $$$ for, crystals, tumbles, and facets. Excellent investment.
 
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